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2L Diesel Temp and Oil Pressure Sensors

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  • 2L Diesel Temp and Oil Pressure Sensors

    Hello all
    My first post on this forum!
    Just to explain first that my interest is in the 2L diesel engine from the Maestro/Montego which I have fitted to an old '59 series 2 Land Rover.

    I'm wanting to fit a temperature gauge and oil pressure gauge to the engine. Currently the engine has what I assume is a standard temperature sensor though it does have two terminal connection, which may not be standard. Ideally I want to connect this to an old Smiths temperature gauge (not a Land Rover gauge). So the question is does anyone know if the standard sensor would be compatible with a old period smiths gauge? Also can anyone confirm the thread details for the temperature sensor?

    For the oil pressure gauge I want to run a capillary tube to a gauge so I need to introduce a tee pieces where the current sensor is located. Has anyone done this and can recommend a suitable tee and again confirm the thread for the existing sensor port.

    Cheers
    Martin


  • #2
    The oil pressure gauge is the easy one, threads are 1/8"npt, same as a classic Mini, t pieces and fittings easy to find at any Mini specialist. There are three temperature sensors, the one with only one connector is for the gauge, the two wire ones are for the fuel pump cold start and fast idle solenoid. Not sure if the sensor will work with the Smiths gauge, probably worth doing a trial and error test on it, you might be able to alter the instrument voltage stabiliser to get it to work correctly. I can check the thread size, I think I've got a housing somewhere..I'd guess at 5/8" unf, but best to bē sure, if it is 5/8", then an old Mini one should do the job, they had Smiths gauges...

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks for the info. Ive actually used the Mini tee before to do exactly this on a Reliant engine so that does make life easy!

      When you say there's three temperature sensors do you mean three on the engine or three different types? I can only see two, the one in the thermostat housing which although it has two connections one connection is to earth and the other I assume should go to the gauge, which doesn't exist yet. The fast idle solenoid is not currently being used - it's there but not wired to anything. The second sensor or switch feeds the radiator fan.

      This Land Rover and engine were rewired before I owned it and it looks like a nice job but there are various bits missing or not connected. As I said the temperature sensor in the housing is wired up but there's nothing on the other end and hardly any of the LR warning lights seem to work. Also there are other sensors which I don't know about yet, like glow plugs and maybe oil temperature. This is first time I've done any work on a diesel engine and I only have the engine manual to refer to which doesn't cover much on electrics side.

      Cheers



      Comment


      • #4
        Sounds as though it has been altered a bit... The two pin sensor in the top of thermostat housing is for fast idle, it is closed when cold, open when warm, one pin should be to ign +, other to the solenoid. The two pin one in the head, behind injector pump is for the cold start on the pump, it is open when cold, advances timing and increases transfer pressure in pump, when warm it closes & puts +12v to the cold start unit on the side of the pump, which sets everything to normal. The temp gauge sensor is in the thermostat housing below the lower of the two pipes, should be one wire. If you have the Rover or Haynes engine book, this information is hidden in the fuel system section iirc....just where you'd not look for electrical information

        Comment


        • #5
          Now we're getting somewhere, thanks for the info.

          Firstly I found the third sensor (one connector) hiding under the lower pipe but there is no wire connected to it so it's currently doing nothing. I can try this sensor on a gauge now and see what happens.

          The two pin sensor in the top of the thermostat housing it wired one pin to earth and the other to dashboard, but nothing connected. Obviously whoever did the wiring thought this was the gauge sensor. As it is this would read max when cold and drop to zero when it it warmed up. The idle solenoid doesn't seem to create much of an issue not being used as the engine ticks over nice when cold or warm.

          The two pin sensor in the head (which I though was oil related) again is wired with one pin to earth and the other to dashboard but with nothing connected to it. So there is no connection to the cold start advance timing unit at all. This seems like it could be a problem as the engine will be running with the advance timing, increased pressure all the time, even when hot. Is it possible that this has been mechanically adjusted to be running normal all the time even when cold? I'm thinking I could put a live feed onto the cold start unit when the engine is warmed up and see if it improves the running.

          Cheers

          I

          Comment


          • #6
            It is the case with the marine turbo diesels that the timing is adjusted and the timing advance not used.
            However in your case I doubt the timing has been set correctly at all. Here is a link to the Perkins manual.
            https://www.hisse-et-oh.com/store/me...6386410038.pdf

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Martingo View Post
              Now we're getting somewhere, thanks for the info.

              Firstly I found the third sensor (one connector) hiding under the lower pipe but there is no wire connected to it so it's currently doing nothing. I can try this sensor on a gauge now and see what happens.

              The two pin sensor in the top of the thermostat housing it wired one pin to earth and the other to dashboard, but nothing connected. Obviously whoever did the wiring thought this was the gauge sensor. As it is this would read max when cold and drop to zero when it it warmed up. The idle solenoid doesn't seem to create much of an issue not being used as the engine ticks over nice when cold or warm.

              The two pin sensor in the head (which I though was oil related) again is wired with one pin to earth and the other to dashboard but with nothing connected to it. So there is no connection to the cold start advance timing unit at all. This seems like it could be a problem as the engine will be running with the advance timing, increased pressure all the time, even when hot. Is it possible that this has been mechanically adjusted to be running normal all the time even when cold? I'm thinking I could put a live feed onto the cold start unit when the engine is warmed up and see if it improves the running.

              Cheers

              I
              I'm not sure how much difference there is between 'normal' and 'cold start' pressure, but easy enough to wire up, the factory engine loom connects the feed to the fuel cut off solenoid to the two temp sensors, you'd only need a couple of short wires to connect the cold start to the sensor. They usually start well anyway (especially if you compare them with the old 2 litre Land Rover diesel ha ha ha!). Sounds as though the previous owner didn't spot the cunningly concealed gauge sensor..... All good fun though....

              Comment


              • #8
                Not made much progress yet but this is what I've found so far.

                Tried a temp gauge on the correct sensor and it does seem to be doing something but I don't actually know if the gauge is good or not. Also needs a 10V supply to read correct and of course the sender might not be right for the gauge anyway.

                I have tried connecting a live to the fast idle and the cold start unit. The fast idle solenoid doesn't move but get a bit of spark off the wire so it is taking some current, I assume the solenoid is duff. When I put a live onto the cold start unit nothing happens at all, not even a spark off the wire. Not sure what should happen or if you can hear it kick in if the engine is not running? Is there any other way to test this or replace the bit that activates it?

                I've noticed now that the thermostat doesn't seem to be kicking in either and the electric fan never comes on, how long would it take for the engine to be up to temperature when stood still?

                I also looked at the oil pressure sensor and connected a wire to the Land Rover warning light. The light is on before the engine is running, it goes off when I start the engine but then comes back on after about 30 seconds, strange?

                Comment


                • #9
                  Might be an idea to try an oil pressure gauge on the engine (same 1/8" npt fittings as a Mini etc), 'just to be sure'... The fast idle solenoid won't push the throttle out on its own , it just holds it out after you've pressed the pedal, so it may be ok? The pump cold start I'm not sure about, but should change the engine note if it is running..I put a timing light on mine & it does alter the timing by a fair bit. They take a long time to warm up, fast idle goes off at 35c iirc, after that the heater keeps it fairly cool on its own, even without the fan on..

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    the timing advance is a waxstat with an electric heater, you should be able to feel it get warm when connected.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Yes I have a tee and pipe ordered to fit an oil pressure gauge.
                      You are right the fast idle solenoid is working, as you said it holds it when it's moved but doesn't push it.

                      I connected live direct to the timing advance and it isn't doing anything and not getting warm. Can you get replacement part for the waxstat?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        If you google BOSCH Expansion Element you will see many different part numbers and i don't know which one you need or if you can change them without something dropping out the pump.
                        They are expensive! Is there a number stamped on the old one?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          I can see a number stamped on it 115.01
                          It looks like the Bosch ones but would need to take it out to be sure...as you said who knows what else will drop out with it - of course it is upside down!
                          So how do you Montego and Maestro guys with the diesel engine fix these problem, I believe the spares are getting difficult to get. Maybe as you mentioned with the marine engine it is possible to set the timing to normal and not have the auto advance feature.

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                          • #14
                            Is that the only number? I have never had any trouble with one. If someone can tell you how many degrees of advance it removes it may be possible adjust the timing.

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                            • #15