2.0TD Sudden Power Loss

[Martingo]

I thought it’s very unlikely 2 injectors would fail together so gasket is the obvious cause now. I’ll swap the injectors as you suggest - will let you know

Not sure whether I feel glad it’s the head gasket, a lot cheaper to fix maybe but a bigger job!

[Doctordiesel77]

Genuine gaskets are not easy to find these days and not cheap...on the plus side you shouldn't need to do it again.

[robert1]

I have had a cheap one dissolve in 6 months,not water proof at all!
https://www.oliveiravalentimlda.com/...aestro-Montego

[Martingo]

I take it that link is to a good gasket set. I had quick look on eBay and you can get one on there for £20 but I’m guessing that’s the one that lasts 6 months! What’s it like ordering from this site?

I can see on the photos that these gaskets have the sealant around the edges. Is the fitting procedure the same as old type gaskets? The reason I ask is I recently fitted head gasket on 850 Reliant engine and you only seem to be able to get these with the sealant around. According to the Reliant crowd they are fitted and then run up to temperature without coolant in the engine then add coolant and run again, it’s long process with three or four tightening stages with 24 hrs between engine runs

[Doctordiesel77]

I have had a cheap one dissolve in 6 months,not water proof at all!
https://www.oliveiravalentimlda.com/...aestro-Montego

Good find! I had a similar experience with a cheap gasket set, mine lasted a year so I was relatively lucky, amazing that they are still on sale.

[robert1]

I have not used them, it is the same gasket the engine was built with so you can do it by the book. even the best after market ones seem to settle over time so the bolt don't clamp well.

[Martingo]

I have asked the guy in Portugal for price to ship to the UK . There are loads of similar gasket sets on eBay that go under the LVQ100630 that’s are pretty expensive too

I was thinking that there’s load to stuff to strip off before you can lift the cylinder head, injectors, turbo, all coolant stuff, camshaft etc. however when I read the manual it seem to say you can lift the lot out in one once you disconnected the obvious things. Is this the way it’s done?

I was going to ask you experts what else I should do whilst it’s all out on the bench- within reason of course!

still need to move one of the injectors to confirm it’s not injector failure. If that’s the case is there any other check I can do to confirm it is the cylinder head gasket? Hard to see what else it could be but imagine lifting it off and finding it was all good!!

[digital efi]

still need to move one of the injectors to confirm it’s not injector failure. If that’s the case is there any other check I can do to confirm it is the cylinder head gasket? Hard to see what else it could be but imagine lifting it off and finding it was all good!!

Compression test? I don't know the Perkins engine that well, but I am assuming you could use a suitable adaptor screwed in to one glow plug hole at a time?

[Doctordiesel77]

Compression test? I don't know the Perkins engine that well, but I am assuming you could use a suitable adaptor screwed in to one glow plug hole at a time?

Yes, diesel compression testers generally include a glow plug adaptor that fits the prima & it is possible to get at the glow plug holes without too much dismantling (injector pipes are to take off iirc.).

[Doctordiesel77]

I have asked the guy in Portugal for price to ship to the UK . There are loads of similar gasket sets on eBay that go under the LVQ100630 that’s are pretty expensive too

I was thinking that there’s load to stuff to strip off before you can lift the cylinder head, injectors, turbo, all coolant stuff, camshaft etc. however when I read the manual it seem to say you can lift the lot out in one once you disconnected the obvious things. Is this the way it’s done?

I was going to ask you experts what else I should do whilst it’s all out on the bench- within reason of course!

still need to move one of the injectors to confirm it’s not injector failure. If that’s the case is there any other check I can do to confirm it is the cylinder head gasket? Hard to see what else it could be but imagine lifting it off and finding it was all good!!

I usually take manifolds off & leave them attached to exhaust etc as it saves disconnecting oil feed/drain to turbo etc, if you leave the injectors in you need to be careful to avoid beheading them as they stick out below head surface, if the head needs to be skimmed you'll need to take them out anyway. Camshaft can stay on the head, unless it needs skimming, or you think valve clearances need checking. If clearances do need checking the easy way is to do them one at a time, with all of the other followers / shims removed, this saves getting the cam holding tool & is the way I still do it even after having bought the 'proper' tool..

[Martingo]

Ok thanks, I will see if I can get my hands on a compression tester, what is the thread size on the glow plugs

is anyone else interested in one on the gasket sets from Portugal? He says he has two

[Martingo]

Not a good day in the garage! Released the pipes and clamps on injectors but they won’t come out. I assume there’s a gizmo to pull them out? Is it ok to turn them to free them, not that they would turn anyway so far.

Also I was looking at access to the two middle cylinders to get the glow plugs out to do compression test, very difficult to get at, all the injector pipes would have to come off.

Anyway something I didn’t mention after I did to injector test. When I released the coupling on cylinder 2 and 3 I got sprayed in the face with diesel coming out of the top of the coupling but this didn’t happen with 1 and 4. My theory is that this means the compression stroke of 2 and 3 is passing through into the next cylinder and pressurising that cylinder when the inlet valve is open so I get face full of diesel. But if this it true why is that pressure in the wrong cylinder not going back up the fuel line into the injector pump and screwing up everything? I guess I’m trying to convince myself that this is definitely head gasket failure across 2 and 3 so I can just go straight into that job

[Doctordiesel77]

Not a good day in the garage! Released the pipes and clamps on injectors but they won’t come out. I assume there’s a gizmo to pull them out? Is it ok to turn them to free them, not that they would turn anyway so far.

Also I was looking at access to the two middle cylinders to get the glow plugs out to do compression test, very difficult to get at, all the injector pipes would have to come off.

Anyway something I didn’t mention after I did to injector test. When I released the coupling on cylinder 2 and 3 I got sprayed in the face with diesel coming out of the top of the coupling but this didn’t happen with 1 and 4. My theory is that this means the compression stroke of 2 and 3 is passing through into the next cylinder and pressurising that cylinder when the inlet valve is open so I get face full of diesel. But if this it true why is that pressure in the wrong cylinder not going back up the fuel line into the injector pump and screwing up everything? I guess I’m trying to convince myself that this is definitely head gasket failure across 2 and 3 so I can just go straight into that job

Turning them back & forward with a dose of penetrating oil down the side should help to release them, there are a variety of tools for getting them out, slide hammer that screws onto the pipe fitting is most common and not hard to make, but only works on top inlet ones. The fuel spray seems odd, the only diesel that should come out is that which is being delivered by the pump, so should be the same on all four. Only way the compression from engine can blow diesel back out is if a) engine has compression & b) injector is either completely beheaded/spring is broken/injector valve isn't sealing. The glow plug threads are M12 x 1.25, but if I was you I'd concentrate on getting the injectors out first. Those gasket sets are reasonably priced for genuine parts, probably worth getting for a spare even if you don't end up needing it!

[Martingo]

Ok I understand, effectively the injector is a one way valve so my scenario isn’t possible. So the reason I get sprayed on 2 and 3 is because the engine/pump continues to run where as 1 and 4 stops the engine/pump dead as soon as the coupling is cracked open.

I’ll give the injectors another go tomorrow, I think I’m worried about doing some damage.

cheers

[Martingo]

Update on injectors

i had to make a slide hammer to get them out. So I swapped injectors 1and 2 then repeated the test. Exactly the same result, number 1 stopped engine dead and 2 made no difference to running.

it’s not injector problem then. Can’t see as it’s anything but head gasket.

Going back to the injectors, how do they seal? I read in the manual about fitting a new seal at the bottoms of the holes but I didn’t have new seals so just reassembled it. I couldn’t actually see a seal but I assume it was there and I didn’t want to disturb it without new ones to fit